The designation of the amorphous group antifa as a terrorist organization allows the state to brand all dissidents as supporters of antifa and prosecute them as terrorists.
For a loose net non organization antifa as you describe them sound pretty organized with a sound plan to disrupt the capitalism system: I'd like to join. Do they have a contact number.
Antifa fights fascism like our colonial brothers and sisters fought and shed blood resisting the tyranny of king George and his Red Coats.
America needs you antifa... help us fight our fascist government.
We can all be anti fascist. In fact, it should be easy given all the big talk we hear from Americans about their precious democracy.
The fallacy of either-or is all over this one.
Either you're a fascist or a terrorist.......so say the rulers of the dying American Empire...so say the MAGA intellectual giants. Truth be told.......you can blend both labels into one anti democratic well armed killing machine.
Given how much America loves Violence, it should sell.
Right. To be anti-fascist is to be a terrorist now. Gives one pause about all the other organizations the self righteous west has laid that label on, does it not??
In one more instance.......the Trumpsters are proving a clarifying force. Now that the gloves are off, there's no excuse for not seeing who we are in the privileged but somewhat disassociate west.
Well said-- Trump and his gang of Brown Shirts are obviously using Antifa as a one-size-fits all movement---to cover any and all criticisms and protests against Trump's ACTUAL fascism.
Stephen Miller would right at home in Salem back in 17th Century or Germany in 1930's.
The only way, as you said in your essay, is to get great numbers of people to put their bodies on the line to protest (as with MLK, Ghandi, The Early Christians, etc.). Will it be possible to tear people away from their hypnotic devices to get out on the streets to protest?
In America, now, entertainment, "information" and 24-hour-a-day "news" are perfect, passive side-kicks to Trump/Miller's storm-troopers...
I am antifa and hope everyone else here is too. If you're not antifa, you're a fascist. It's that simple. If you think you can beat fascists only with orderly matches, "We Shall Overcome" and Kumbaya", you are dangerously naive.
“If you’re not Antifa you’re a fascist”. So, no room for any opinion other than Antifa’s. Room for more than one political party? What other measures would you recommend against those who don’t comply?
There are many ways to be against fascism Paul.......labelling those of us who identify as antifa (short for anitfascist) as fascist........is either silly or confused.
Antifa isn't a single idea....let alone a political party. It's broad movement that's against fascism..........for the most part, it knows what fascism is....and can describe fascistic characteristics.
It's not a monolith. But to focus in on the idiocy of calling antifa a terrorist organization.......being against fascism suggests you're against the terrorism that death cult usually ends up endorsing.
It's fascists playing the 'call our opponents 'terrorists' game.
We should thank them in some ways.........it reveals how thin the west's 'terrorist' label actually quite often is.
There is a limit you know......to projecting your problems/sins onto the people calling out said problems/sins. The right wing is over using that trick now.
You have no idea what problems I may have or what sins I may have committed or vice versa. I was merely commenting on the attitude that I anyone is not antifa then they are fascist, which is utter nonsense. And just as an extension, what punishment members of Antifa mistakenly think they have the right to inflict on those who don’t agree with them. Now, that’s fascism.
You don't understand the term Paul...Antifa is short for Anti fascist.
You can't logically be anti fascist and a terrorist.....fascism has a corner on terrorism...especially the really well armed government kind.
Read Umberto Ecco's description of Fascism.........he lived under it as a boy in Italy........once you see the characteristics.......you realize that to be against fascism is to be for a lot of things fascists dislike.
For example: DEI, inclusion, social fairness, democracy............
There's a terrible butchering of the English language going on in America.....being seriously against fascism means you can't support terrorism.....so labelling Antifa a terrorist organization makes no sense.
My comment wasn’t about labelling Antifa as a terrorist organisation, it was about the comment that if you’re not antifa then you’re a fascist. I know what Antifa is short for but just declaring yourself to be anti fascist doesn’t make it so. The additional comments that protests and flag waving will not be enough to defeat those who you identify as fascists means what exactly? That you have the right to kill them? And you have that right because they have different opinions and views to yours and, therefore, must be punished for not following the party line? Antifa is not anti fascist, it is fascist. It demands that everyone must follow the party line; it enforces that policy with violent thugs who, ironically, frequently wear black attire aping Mussolini’s black shirts. Perhaps switching to brown and changing your name Strongly Antifascist would also work since then you could just be called the SA. Antifa is not an anti fascist organisation, it’s an anti anybody who doesn’t agree with us organisation.
Point taken. However it remains the case that the people with their hands on the reins of power just now in the USA demonstrate more fascistic tendencies than anything I'm aware Antifa has done. We need to all be alert to the dread double standard in these designations.
In what I assume to be your country.......the people in power are fine with masked policemen arresting and detaining people without due process. That is not a police force that I'm willing to support.......that resembles more a gestapo in training. Still......listening to right wing TV. there's a crazy call to 'respect our law enforcement'.....100%. Demonize the young man who committed suicide by spraying a detention centre with bullets.....neglect to name the 'detainees' killed and wounded.....AS A MATTER OF COURSE.
I think we both know that anyone in favour of how ICE has been operating wants the sole right to designate who the fascists are.........and who is committing terrorism: AND IT WON'T BE THEM, OR THEIR SIDE.
So saying "if you aren't anti fascist, you're likely a fascist" may sound like a bit of a reduction.........and for sure......no one organization has a monopoly on determining who's a fascist. But much of these guibbles are designed to overlook the actual issue in this situation.
ONLY FASCISTS WOULD DECLARE AN ANTI-FASCIST MOVEMENT AS A TERRORIST ORGANIZATION. Buying into such kaka......suggests, if not fascistic tendencies, for sure a conventional way of thinking that stays silent while the rule of law is ignored and large scale crimes are committed.......against the poor, the unhoused and the people who's skin colour is darker than the whited sepulchres pretending to stand next to God.
Capitalist bourgeois society may have inherent fascistic tendencies...historically they seem fine with the persecution/oppression/exclusion of large parts of the human family.
For me, that deep indifference to injustice visited on 'the others' is an innate part of, if not outright fascism, why fascism so often has prevailed.
So, somewhat like branding Catholics and other white conservatives as white supremacists or domestic terrorists. I see no reason why both sides shouldn’t get to play this game.
For a loose net non organization antifa as you describe them sound pretty organized with a sound plan to disrupt the capitalism system: I'd like to join. Do they have a contact number.
Antifa fights fascism like our colonial brothers and sisters fought and shed blood resisting the tyranny of king George and his Red Coats.
America needs you antifa... help us fight our fascist government.
We can all be anti fascist. In fact, it should be easy given all the big talk we hear from Americans about their precious democracy.
The fallacy of either-or is all over this one.
Either you're a fascist or a terrorist.......so say the rulers of the dying American Empire...so say the MAGA intellectual giants. Truth be told.......you can blend both labels into one anti democratic well armed killing machine.
Given how much America loves Violence, it should sell.
refuse fascism
oppose oppression
DEI for all not the few
Plus BDS.......boycott, divest and sanction.
Arming a genocide is business as usual, for fascists.
Don't be complicit.
Right. To be anti-fascist is to be a terrorist now. Gives one pause about all the other organizations the self righteous west has laid that label on, does it not??
In one more instance.......the Trumpsters are proving a clarifying force. Now that the gloves are off, there's no excuse for not seeing who we are in the privileged but somewhat disassociate west.
Well said-- Trump and his gang of Brown Shirts are obviously using Antifa as a one-size-fits all movement---to cover any and all criticisms and protests against Trump's ACTUAL fascism.
Stephen Miller would right at home in Salem back in 17th Century or Germany in 1930's.
The only way, as you said in your essay, is to get great numbers of people to put their bodies on the line to protest (as with MLK, Ghandi, The Early Christians, etc.). Will it be possible to tear people away from their hypnotic devices to get out on the streets to protest?
In America, now, entertainment, "information" and 24-hour-a-day "news" are perfect, passive side-kicks to Trump/Miller's storm-troopers...
I am antifa and hope everyone else here is too. If you're not antifa, you're a fascist. It's that simple. If you think you can beat fascists only with orderly matches, "We Shall Overcome" and Kumbaya", you are dangerously naive.
Spoken like a true fascist Bob.
Huh?
“If you’re not Antifa you’re a fascist”. So, no room for any opinion other than Antifa’s. Room for more than one political party? What other measures would you recommend against those who don’t comply?
There are many ways to be against fascism Paul.......labelling those of us who identify as antifa (short for anitfascist) as fascist........is either silly or confused.
Antifa isn't a single idea....let alone a political party. It's broad movement that's against fascism..........for the most part, it knows what fascism is....and can describe fascistic characteristics.
It's not a monolith. But to focus in on the idiocy of calling antifa a terrorist organization.......being against fascism suggests you're against the terrorism that death cult usually ends up endorsing.
It's fascists playing the 'call our opponents 'terrorists' game.
We should thank them in some ways.........it reveals how thin the west's 'terrorist' label actually quite often is.
Huh????
There is a limit you know......to projecting your problems/sins onto the people calling out said problems/sins. The right wing is over using that trick now.
It's way past its before due date.
You have no idea what problems I may have or what sins I may have committed or vice versa. I was merely commenting on the attitude that I anyone is not antifa then they are fascist, which is utter nonsense. And just as an extension, what punishment members of Antifa mistakenly think they have the right to inflict on those who don’t agree with them. Now, that’s fascism.
You don't understand the term Paul...Antifa is short for Anti fascist.
You can't logically be anti fascist and a terrorist.....fascism has a corner on terrorism...especially the really well armed government kind.
Read Umberto Ecco's description of Fascism.........he lived under it as a boy in Italy........once you see the characteristics.......you realize that to be against fascism is to be for a lot of things fascists dislike.
For example: DEI, inclusion, social fairness, democracy............
There's a terrible butchering of the English language going on in America.....being seriously against fascism means you can't support terrorism.....so labelling Antifa a terrorist organization makes no sense.
ITS A FASCISTIC MOVE.
My comment wasn’t about labelling Antifa as a terrorist organisation, it was about the comment that if you’re not antifa then you’re a fascist. I know what Antifa is short for but just declaring yourself to be anti fascist doesn’t make it so. The additional comments that protests and flag waving will not be enough to defeat those who you identify as fascists means what exactly? That you have the right to kill them? And you have that right because they have different opinions and views to yours and, therefore, must be punished for not following the party line? Antifa is not anti fascist, it is fascist. It demands that everyone must follow the party line; it enforces that policy with violent thugs who, ironically, frequently wear black attire aping Mussolini’s black shirts. Perhaps switching to brown and changing your name Strongly Antifascist would also work since then you could just be called the SA. Antifa is not an anti fascist organisation, it’s an anti anybody who doesn’t agree with us organisation.
Point taken. However it remains the case that the people with their hands on the reins of power just now in the USA demonstrate more fascistic tendencies than anything I'm aware Antifa has done. We need to all be alert to the dread double standard in these designations.
In what I assume to be your country.......the people in power are fine with masked policemen arresting and detaining people without due process. That is not a police force that I'm willing to support.......that resembles more a gestapo in training. Still......listening to right wing TV. there's a crazy call to 'respect our law enforcement'.....100%. Demonize the young man who committed suicide by spraying a detention centre with bullets.....neglect to name the 'detainees' killed and wounded.....AS A MATTER OF COURSE.
I think we both know that anyone in favour of how ICE has been operating wants the sole right to designate who the fascists are.........and who is committing terrorism: AND IT WON'T BE THEM, OR THEIR SIDE.
So saying "if you aren't anti fascist, you're likely a fascist" may sound like a bit of a reduction.........and for sure......no one organization has a monopoly on determining who's a fascist. But much of these guibbles are designed to overlook the actual issue in this situation.
ONLY FASCISTS WOULD DECLARE AN ANTI-FASCIST MOVEMENT AS A TERRORIST ORGANIZATION. Buying into such kaka......suggests, if not fascistic tendencies, for sure a conventional way of thinking that stays silent while the rule of law is ignored and large scale crimes are committed.......against the poor, the unhoused and the people who's skin colour is darker than the whited sepulchres pretending to stand next to God.
Capitalist bourgeois society may have inherent fascistic tendencies...historically they seem fine with the persecution/oppression/exclusion of large parts of the human family.
For me, that deep indifference to injustice visited on 'the others' is an innate part of, if not outright fascism, why fascism so often has prevailed.
So, somewhat like branding Catholics and other white conservatives as white supremacists or domestic terrorists. I see no reason why both sides shouldn’t get to play this game.
Please, please, respond to Graeber's argument against your attacks on Brown blocs and Antifa:
https://thenewinquiry.com/concerning-the-violent-peace-police-an-open-letter-to-chris-hedges/